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View Full Version : New to the forum ...looking for opinions



Norseman
03-01-2013, 08:42 AM
Hey guys, I've been playing 20 years. I've got some pretty nice guitars in my collection (mid level stuff ...Shecter, ESP, Ibanez) and my favorite higher end of all is a Gibson Les Paul Classic. However for gigging I have an ESP LTD EC-1000FR Deluxe that I just love. The LTD is ESP's "made in Korea" line ...like the PRS SE series guitars.

So last week I'm at Guitar Center helping a friend pick out a guitar and the salesman puts some kind of $3,000 PRS in my hands. I'm not in the market for it and $3,000 is way more than I'm looking to spend on a guitar so I didn't pay close attention. But it really felt awesome ...playability was so freakin' great that I haven't been able to stop thinking about it.

So now I'm looking at adding a PRS. I should probably just wait until next year, but I'm like an addict and just really badly want to add a PRS to my collection now. (In like a year or two God willing I will be able to add a really high end PRS but not just yet.) Since I can't afford a brand new USA made PRS, I'm looking at picking up something used but in great condition. I've found some guitars and before I plunk down I figured I'd throw this out to you PRS fans and see what you say.

Here's what I'm looking at:
PRS STANDARD 24 STRAWB W/OHSC for $1200
PRS CE24 TRANS RED for $1200
PRS CE24 SCARLET RED WC for $1100
PRS SE TORERO CRIMSON RED for $640

The SE TORERO is probably going to be the closest thing to my ESP - they both have EMGs and a Floyd Rose. Would the CE or Standard models really be THAT much better than the SE TORERO? Like what are some differences that would make you definitely spend the extra money for the CE or Standard?

vchizzle
03-01-2013, 09:16 AM
My vote to go for the Standard 24 - great sounding and playing guitars! Underrated IMO. THAT much better than the Torero? The SE's are VERY well built, but they just aren't the same. The Torero in particular is a very different feeling and playing guitar, mostly because of the fretboard radius. The Torero is much flatter feeling. Might feel better to the speed demons and shredders if that's what they are used to. I don't like that feel myself, but I've been playing the USA PRS exclusively for 17 years...so that's what feels right to me.

I guess my advice is, if it felt really awesome and that's why you continue to obsess and think about it - you should definitely go after a US built PRS. The standard with the set neck is gonna be closest to that feel - assuming it had a painted neck, it was probably a Custom of some sort. Anything else you remember about it? Trem or stoptail? number of frets?

Welcome to the addict's clubhouse:biggrin:

MOBirds
03-01-2013, 09:21 AM
ROFL that's how I got into PRS guitars. I was comparing LPs and Strats and complaining to the sales guy that neither really felt comfortable. He handed me a PRS Johnny Hiland signature and said "We just got this in, haven't even priced it. Give it a try". I bought and since sold that one, and added 3 others. Welcome to the machine!

Norseman
03-01-2013, 09:39 AM
I don't really remember what model (I don't even know that I looked ...I just saw the price tag lol), but I'm going to GC tomorrow and going to play a bunch of different ones and see what feels best to me. (I've spent enough money in there that they don't mind if I come in and spend a couple hours trying out guitars and then don't buy anything lol.)

See to me and my taste I think I'd like that Torero. But after spending a couple hours reading posts in this forum, I'm convinced I should spend a couple bucks more and get a USA made PRS. If I can get a used around $1100 I guess that's pretty fair, right? I see guys in here saying they paid $800 but there's nothing in my area that I can touch for less than about $1100. Maybe talk them down to $1000. Honestly if the guitar(s) is all you guys say it is, it's a steal at $1200.

I like the "look" of the CE24 over the Standard that I've found because I like that "see through cherry" over the flat red, but I'm limiting myself to what's available used in my area. What are some key differences? Wood, shape and everything looks the same to me. I'm guessing the contours of the neck and pickups might be the only differences. Also I've never played a PRS with a tremolo. Can you do like dive bombs and stuff with those trems? Can you pull up? Like you know with a Floyd Rose you can push it 'til the strings are lying loose on the fretboard, or pull it all the way up and make the note climb 2 or more full steps up (I do this with harmonics a lot ...like Dimebag Darrell-ish). Can a PRS trem handle that kind of abuse or is it like the Fender where it's more a subtle vibrato kind of trem?

Norseman
03-01-2013, 09:46 AM
And thanks for the help guys!!

MOBirds
03-01-2013, 10:57 AM
The PRS tremolo has a bit of play upward, and you can do sort of dive bombish stuff but neither is anywhere near a locked Floyd Rose. I suppose that's why Floyd's exist, nothing else really does what they do.

docbennett
03-01-2013, 12:33 PM
Try to get the used USA made one. It will provide you with a better entrance into the overall PRS experience. Plus, in today's economy, if you get a nice, cheaper (relatively speaking) USA made one...you should be able to flip it for close to what you paid when you're ready to trade up to a higher end model. Which will be inevitable. And, when that happens...your biggest struggle will be to figure out how you will be able to buy the next PRS WITHOUT giving up the one you buy now!

Good luck. Post again, and tell us how you make out. Welcome to our addiction. Jump in..the water is fine.

Norseman
03-01-2013, 01:01 PM
Try to get the used USA made one. It will provide you with a better entrance into the overall PRS experience. Plus, in today's economy, if you get a nice, cheaper (relatively speaking) USA made one...you should be able to flip it for close to what you paid when you're ready to trade up to a higher end model. Which will be inevitable. And, when that happens...your biggest struggle will be to figure out how you will be able to buy the next PRS WITHOUT giving up the one you buy now!

Good luck. Post again, and tell us how you make out. Welcome to our addiction. Jump in..the water is fine.

Hahah ...last thing I need is an addiction within the addiction. I'm already a gear junky. I have a career that pays the bills (thank God), but I also play in a band and pickup about $200 cash a week ...I mean nothing to write home about, but the second I have a couple bucks of that gig money saved BAM! I'm buying something new. Soooo I guess what you're saying now that I've caught the scent of PRS THAT is where my gig money will be going? Just what I need. LOL

The CE24 is a USA model, correct?

Norseman
03-01-2013, 01:01 PM
I've got 2 guitars with Floyd Rose trems, so I am excited to try this PRS system!

Norseman
03-01-2013, 01:56 PM
Jeez now I see a Custom 24 with bird inlays that I want ...but it's like $1700 ...that's too rich for me right now. If I were smart, I would just keep the money in the bank. I don't need another guitar. Talk me out of it guys.

John Beef
03-01-2013, 02:02 PM
I like the "look" of the CE24 over the Standard that I've found because I like that "see through cherry" over the flat red, but I'm limiting myself to what's available used in my area. What are some key differences? Wood, shape and everything looks the same to me. I'm guessing the contours of the neck and pickups might be the only differences.
The finish is only the beginning of the differences between these two models. The CE has a maple top over either a mahogany or alder back, depending on the year it was made. It also has a maple neck with rosewood fretboard, and the neck is bolted into the body beneath the neck pickup. It's a very different animal from the Standard. The standard has a solid mahogany body with mahogany neck and rosewood fretboard. The neck is also glued in, no bolts. The two guitars are going to sound very different from one another even though they are both equipped with the same pickups. Neither is better than the other, they're just different. It's definitely all about personal taste and what your ear likes to hear.

Norseman
03-01-2013, 02:25 PM
Ok that's good info! So if I like it, I'll just get it and not worry that the other guitar is "better". I've never been a fan of bolt-on necks. You guys don't find they need adjustments more frequently?

sergiodeblanc
03-01-2013, 02:35 PM
You guys don't find they need adjustments more frequently?

nope.

Goldtop
03-01-2013, 03:03 PM
Norseman,

I'm obviously not in your shoes, and I wouldn't claim to know what you think or what you should do (I have enough to do dealing with those subjects in my own life), but based on your posts, it seems to me like you found some guitars that made you curious, have some money to spare, and are itching to spend it. That's easliy understandable; who among us hasn't been in the same position once - or a hundred - times?

But, there's no need to jump before you're sure about what you want, what you need, etc. It sounds like part of the incentive for you is that you found some prices within your range. IMO, that's not a great reason to take the plunge.

My suggestion is to wait, do ALL of the research you feel you need to do, then move forward. You buy model X, you check around some, and in a few days you learn that maybe model Y would be more of what you're after. In your haste, you've created at least a bit more work for yourself, if not a whole new set of problems. What's the rush? IMO, better to take a little longer and get what you're sure you want, than to act quickly and get what you think you might want. Who knows? Maybe your best move really is to wait until next year like you said. By then you'll have more knowledge and more money to spend.

Just my advice for what it is or isn't worth.

Goldtop Lloyd

dmorton67
03-01-2013, 03:18 PM
Norseman,

I'm obviously not in your shoes, and I wouldn't claim to know what you think or what you should do (I have enough to do dealing with those subjects in my own life), but based on your posts, it seems to me like you found some guitars that made you curious, have some money to spare, and are itching to spend it. That's easliy understandable; who among us hasn't been in the same position once - or a hundred - times?

But, there's no need to jump before you're sure about what you want, what you need, etc. It sounds like part of the incentive for you is that you found some prices within your range. IMO, that's not a great reason to take the plunge.

My suggestion is to wait, do ALL of the research you feel you need to do, then move forward. You buy model X, you check around some, and in a few days you learn that maybe model Y would be more of what you're after. In your haste, you've created at least a bit more work for yourself, if not a whole new set of problems. What's the rush? IMO, better to take a little longer and get what you're sure you want, than to act quickly and get what you think you might want. Who knows? Maybe your best move really is to wait until next year like you said. By then you'll have more knowledge and more money to spend.

Just my advice for what it is or isn't worth.

Goldtop Lloyd


I whole heartily agree. Why spend money just to have something that you're not 100% satisfied with and will be wishing you had something else? Don't settle. Work and save some more for what you really want. In the long run, you'll be happier. Look at the bigger picture.

John Beef
03-01-2013, 03:26 PM
Ok that's good info! So if I like it, I'll just get it and not worry that the other guitar is "better". I've never been a fan of bolt-on necks. You guys don't find they need adjustments more frequently?
Bolt-on necks - I could see if you meant the standard F*nder neck with its humongous heel, which is positively massive and bordering on unplayable on the high frets, IMHO. In the case of PRS guitars, the neck is a "bolt-in" (not a "bolt-on") in that the neck inserts into the body under the neck pickup, so the heel under the frets is exactly the same between the two, at least in comparable model years. So, how it connects to the body isn't an issue of playability, it's more a matter of tone. A CE is going to be snappier with its maple neck and bolt-in construction. A Standard is going to be meatier. And if you're finding bolt-on necks require more adjustment, that's more a testament to the inferior woods other brands use.

This is a CE from the back:
http://www.islandguitarstudios.com/sales/prs241.jpg

This is a standard from the back:

http://dreamguitars.com/products/prs/prs_custom_22_artist_7115752/images/back.jpg

docbennett
03-01-2013, 03:57 PM
Norseman,

I'm obviously not in your shoes, and I wouldn't claim to know what you think or what you should do (I have enough to do dealing with those subjects in my own life), but based on your posts, it seems to me like you found some guitars that made you curious, have some money to spare, and are itching to spend it. That's easliy understandable; who among us hasn't been in the same position once - or a hundred - times?

But, there's no need to jump before you're sure about what you want, what you need, etc. It sounds like part of the incentive for you is that you found some prices within your range. IMO, that's not a great reason to take the plunge.

My suggestion is to wait, do ALL of the research you feel you need to do, then move forward. You buy model X, you check around some, and in a few days you learn that maybe model Y would be more of what you're after. In your haste, you've created at least a bit more work for yourself, if not a whole new set of problems. What's the rush? IMO, better to take a little longer and get what you're sure you want, than to act quickly and get what you think you might want. Who knows? Maybe your best move really is to wait until next year like you said. By then you'll have more knowledge and more money to spend.

Just my advice for what it is or isn't worth.

Goldtop Lloyd

First....I have to agree with Lloyd 100%....that's my disclaimer. IN THEORY, Lloyd is totally correct and his words are true words of wisdom.

Now......this is REAL LIFE......this is what is going to happen....mark my words: :flute:

you will weigh the pros and cons many times...you will continue to add and subtract from the list many times. Certain features will wax and wane as you further your research. You will become "an expert in theory" with regard to the different models...especially those within your price range in the not-too-distant future.

By now, a few weeks may pass. You will enjoy the process of the research, and you will enjoy the eager anticipation of the new guitar.

By now, your list of pros and cons is about 100 items strong.

In weighing your options...you find that there are virtually the same amount of pros as cons for each model you are in final consideration of. You will note all the differences, and try to weigh which ones contribute most and least to what you are seeking.

After a while of evaluating your list of pros and cons and all that research...you will take a deep breath and make a final decision based on the guitar with the nicest top, and the best colored inlays. :proud:

Because other than that, you'll be unable to come up with a final significant difference between all of these great guitars that makes the difference between buy or pass....and you will be wishing you could afford to buy them all.

Alternatively, you will actually choose based upon a certain number of features that outweigh the others.....

If that's the case.....after you get the new (used) guitar....you will love it. You will see that it's in a class way beyond what you've been used to playing. You will then realize the differences between the one you got and the one(s) you passed on, as you get more familiar with it.

You will start to crave a guitar that has those features you passed on, but you will be unwilling to sell what you've just received because it's the best guitar you've ever played.


AT this point...WELCOME TO OUR CLUB! :laugh: I can't help you from there. I'm trying to deal with these issues myself! :biggrin:

Rango
03-01-2013, 04:47 PM
I'd go take a look at the gear page and the for sale forums on the Vintage Rocker - You may find something there that appeals to you for an amazing price compared to new. ;)

I jumped in with a P22 and couldn't be happier. ;)
Good Hunting! :D

swede71
03-01-2013, 06:13 PM
What about the guitar the salesman put in your hands?What says the CEs or the Toreros will have the same magic as the one you cant stop thinking about?

gush
03-02-2013, 09:27 PM
Well Norseman you have a problem. I too have a LP classic but i dont play it anymore. I am most likely going to let it go and replace it with another prs. My wife got me a used mccarty and that got the prs ball rollin for me.

I cant comment on the prs guitars you mentioned but I will comment on the ones I own. My mccarty and cu22 are great guitars but my cu24 is fabulous! Those 5909s are very nice and the cu24 has a top that is incredible to look at.


I used to have a large fleet of guitars but one time i took my rg570 to a gig, after playing my mccarty I put the 570 on and quickly decided prs was the real deal. I had 3 RGs a couple of kramers a charvel model 4 and a few others. Sold them all and never looked back. Now I have 3 prs guitars. No shame in used as two of mine are used with no regrets. Good luck

Norseman
03-05-2013, 10:36 AM
Hey I want to thank all of you guys for your input here! I'm still on my quest. I played some PRS guitars in Guitar Center this weekend ...honestly don't care too much for the PRS tremolo over the Floyd Rose. They are good for a little vibrato and the guitars stay in tune perfectly ...but you're not going to do dive bombs and stuff like with the Floyd Rose. I think Lloyd is spot on LOL